Shattered Kingdoms

There is a monumental amount of RP that would need to go into bringing the Black Hand back. It's not an "oh, hey, yeah, we're back" situation.

For the benefit of us who are new players (just me? idk), what would this be?

Also... regarding this topic and related things, is there ever a point there the current player-base will no longer be responsible for the actions of past players and IMMs? For some of these things, if we go along with the assumption that Pyrathia has other inhabitants besides PCs, it seems weird that e.g. Seaside would stay closed for centuries.

I don't actually have the authority to say that this is a possibility, as it would need to go through D. It was removed roughly in tandem with the Guardians for balance reasons, and that story has been chronicled more publicly as more people were involved. The Hand was relatively small at the time, but due diligence was done, role play opportunities were given, if ignored on the larger scale, and this is the short version:

When the Council of Necromancers fled the north, it was the active betrayal of the leader of the Black Hand that forced them out. Lydia worked in collusion with the leaders of the northern tribes. Together they sought to empower their brand of tribal rule and government anarchy over the rule of the council of necromancers, who only represented Krychire and maybe the Moot.

So ... a lot. Someone would have to manage to convince them that they're trustworthy while being evil enough to even fit the thematic bill. Lydia had been given plenty of leeway to take the tribunal in whatever direction she wanted, and instead she worked to completely unfurl it (IC. OOCly It was going away either way, but.... you know.)

The current player base is encouraged to make its mark on the kingdoms and change things that they don't like. But things need to be built or rebuilt to facilitate this stuff. It can't happen overnight. I don't know the current state of affairs in Seaside, but I do know that it's not as easy as just adding an exit and letting people back in, particularly when some areas are closed for balance reasons. (and please maintain reasonable expectations of the staff in terms of facilitating and implementing things. I know sometimes that the requests seem relatively small, but I promise we don't purposely put anyone off )

The assumption in Pyrathia is that players are the heroes: That you're the ones making the moves.

Seaside has been dealt with ICly, and I do appreciate being given the chance for my character to make her mark on Pyrathia. But it really did take a massive amount of effort on the part of a couple of players. It seems a bit daunting, if not impossible, to fix the mistakes of past players in a similar manner, especially when it's something as big and (IMO, negative) as closing two tribunals.... and, as I just saw your second post, it was a decision made to close it OOCly either way.

Nobody on the staff is sadistic enough to allow a player to put in the work for something that they point blank don't intend to facilitate. I know I've let some thing get shifted around on the stovetop when players take their characters off the burner, though (Mortoon, for example).

As the immortal currently involved in Seaside, I will just throw out one of the things that I always come back to. It's always harder to involve players in changes. Not because they aren't super interested in making changes, not because they aren't completely capable of coming up with descriptions and such, but because it turns any project into more of a collaboration.

None of that means it isn't worth it, in fact, quite the opposite. I think despite the extra effort and time required, the more player-involved content that happens the better. There is a certain level of investment from those players, and often times people's favorite areas become those they had some hand in creating, or changing in some way. There was someone who had a really cool idea they wanted to develop, and sadly the back-end just wasn't there to do it the right way, but I can honestly say it wasn't something I had thought of much until that player brought it up. Since then, it's something I've kept in the back of my mind if/when it's more feasible to make happen. So, even if changes don't happen immediately for whatever reason, lots of times it's player RP and player ideas that can drive a change on down the line as well. For something like bringing back a tribunal, you're also going to be talking about player count considerations and other issues that sadly are out of the control of the character that wants to bring them back. Doesn't make it a bad idea, or bad RP, it just means it may be impossible for that character to have a happy ending right now.

I just wanted to shed a bit of light on things, and the above may not be true for every staff member. I just know my angel area was much easier for me to complete than any area I touched afterwards, and it was mostly because it was ideas to paper, and then paper to game. But despite liking my area, my favorite place in the game is still one I was involved with describing as a player.

Just wanted to mention that I picked Seaside because of my limited OOC knowledge of the game's history and changes within, not because I have a problem with how that area is being handled right now. Sorry if that felt like a slap in the face, Algorab!

Algorab has some tough skin, I'm sure he didn't take that personally.

Anyway, I was just saying that if your character wanted to bring back the CoN and it was a non-starter, we would just explain that to you up front.

Interestingly enough, on the subject of favorite areas, mine isn't in the game yet. It's something I came up with before I joined the staff, but I hadn't nearly enough knowledge about scripting to make it a reality when I did. Plus it needed some (fairly major) improvements. But I'm hoping to get this tiny slice of paradise it into the game soon!

I would be happy to assist in any capacity I can to getting the black hand open again. While it's no guarantee, I feel like having another tribunal option would encourage players to pop back in and test the waters. I have some rough ic ideas on how to get the ball rolling on my current character and the others he's surrounded with if this is indeed an option at some point.